tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post2555255481729576382..comments2023-09-09T04:03:00.560-05:00Comments on The Fortress of Soliloquy: Supermonth: Supertropes I Hate: Soul-VisionUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-47044739605423992192008-08-22T18:04:00.000-05:002008-08-22T18:04:00.000-05:00Rao you just got schooled. SUPER schooled...Rao you just got schooled. SUPER schooled...LurkerWithouthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03540770911478925992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-85247362638241986542008-08-22T17:39:00.000-05:002008-08-22T17:39:00.000-05:00Will: Totally agreed.Justin: It's one thing to hav...Will: Totally agreed.<BR/><BR/>Justin: It's one thing to have the "immigrant" aspect, it's another thing to have the "outsider alien barred from assimilation" aspect. The former is Superman, the latter is Martian Manhunter--to a degree, anyway. Birthright made Superman an unwelcome outsider in nearly every aspect of his life. <BR/><BR/>Lurker: True enough; still, Medphyll was from a whole planet of plant people, and there are others like Swamp Thing and Floronic Man floating about out there. And then there are folks like Blok or Shrapnel or Girder who are all "living" amalgamations of various non-meat substances. Does soul-vision reveal their life force? <BR/><BR/>Rao: 1. Super-ventriloquism <I>wasn't</I> rooted in real-world physics. There's a big difference between being able to make a cone or column of localized sound in a room, and being able to transmit sounds with pinpoint accuracy across a city, with no interference from obstacles. Sound is not light; it doesn't work the same as a laser, certainly not on large scales. <BR/><BR/>2. There's a very large difference between "real world" physics and "disputed" physics. <BR/><BR/>3. Looking at Vernadsky's Wikipedia entry, I don't see anything about animals giving off special invisible soul-energy. I see some vague stuff that sounds like it's trying to map determinism onto evolution, but that's pretty far from being able to see souls. <BR/><BR/>4. Which brings us to the point that there's <I>no scientific basis to support the existence of the soul</I> or anything like it. Dualism has been soundly refuted by modern biology and neurology. So, I don't see how "Superman can tell Superboy that he has a soul, 'cause he can see it" is rooted in anything even remotely associated with real-world physics. <BR/><BR/>5. <B>And furthermore, the idea that Superman can see the energy fields that correlate to life is completely consistent with his thematic tropes.</B><BR/><BR/>I disagree, for one. While I'm all for the monomythic, messianic aspects of Superman, his power set usually doesn't extend into the mystical and metaphysical. In fact, they tend to stick to the <I>physical</I>--flight, strength, senses, not seeing souls. <BR/>For two, you miss about <I>half the damn point</I>, in that the definition of "living things" given in the story (implicitly) is utterly flawed, since it only seems to apply to animals. There are five other kingdoms of living things on Earth, and Superman has colleagues who belong to at least three of them. <BR/>And for three, you miss the other half of the point, in that it trivializes Superman's motivation for helping people. Suddenly, it's not because he feels it's his responsibility, or because of the love and camaraderie he feels for his adopted planet, it's because he can't stand seeing animals die. <BR/><BR/>6. <B>Superman is merely a sci-fi character. He's a modern day Ameircan myth in sci-fi trappings.</B><BR/><BR/>How does that support your point at all? Okay, so he's a sci-fi character...since when is "the soul" a sci-fi concept? Seems to me that's typically a fantasy trope. What is it about a sci-fi American myth that makes "seeing souls" a sensible ability? <BR/><BR/>7. <B>He made Superman from a myth into a Marvel character reminicent of Spider-Man.</B><BR/><BR/>Have you ever <I>read</I> Birthright? The whole damn thing is about what an outsider Superman is, how everyone hates him as Clark Kent and how everyone distrusts him as Superman. It's about how his adopted homeworld rejects him and his tragic past keeps coming back to hurt and haunt him. Byrne's Superman was beloved, mostly happy-go-lucky, had a loving family and a general sense of optimism. Which one sounds more like "a Marvel character reminiscent of Spider-Man" to you?Tom Fosshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13796424725228769265noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-30916132847721870892008-08-22T16:31:00.000-05:002008-08-22T16:31:00.000-05:00Yet again, like in your post on Superventriloqism,...Yet again, like in your post on Superventriloqism, you don't realize that this abililty is rooted solidly in real world--disputed--physics theory. look up vi vernadsky.<BR/><BR/>And furthermore, the idea that Superman can see the energy fields that correlate to life is completely consistent with his thematic tropes. Superman is merely a sci-fi character. He's a modern day Ameircan myth in sci-fi trappings.<BR/><BR/>That's why Byrnes superman will never be a legitimate incarnation of the character. He made Superman from a myth into a Marvel character reminicent of Spider-Man.Raohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07135225387899880465noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-72956208151874627762008-08-16T05:26:00.000-05:002008-08-16T05:26:00.000-05:00I'm pretty sure Medphyll is killed during his appe...I'm pretty sure Medphyll is killed during his appearance in <B>Starman</B>. But I don't have the issues from that story arc so I can't check. But if so I'd guess he won't have an aura any more...<BR/><BR/>But yeah, Aura Vision for Superman is pretty stupid...LurkerWithouthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03540770911478925992noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-53108242354318555782008-08-16T00:18:00.000-05:002008-08-16T00:18:00.000-05:00I always saw Birthright as the big, dumb action mo...I always saw Birthright as the big, dumb action movie version of Superman's origin, and I really pay it little mind. Man of Steel was the version that came out when I was a kid, so I guess that'll always be canon for me, despite the jerk that Byrne is these days.<BR/><BR/>Anyhoo, I'd definitely recommend It's Superman, it's a hoot. I may need to grab that at the library tomorrow and give it another read.Jasonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05447056995172551179noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-50827970812368060892008-08-15T04:31:00.000-05:002008-08-15T04:31:00.000-05:00I enjoyed the alien aspect of Superman. One thing...I enjoyed the alien aspect of Superman. One thing that gets mentioned a lot is the "immigrant" aspect of Superman, and that isn't played up a lot. But they did it really well in Birthright. Everything from the curiosity about his legacy, to recognising his culture through his costume, it is all very much part of a good immigrant character.<BR/><BR/>Soul vision is silly though.Justinhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00874212739089117296noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-30533168432276859542008-08-15T01:22:00.000-05:002008-08-15T01:22:00.000-05:00Oh, and It's Superman is nothing at all like Super...Oh, and <I>It's Superman</I> is nothing at all like Superman as we know him, but it's a good read all the same. I recommend it.Will Stapleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05102456593495895955noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-13848504.post-16976966298966166722008-08-15T01:19:00.000-05:002008-08-15T01:19:00.000-05:00The thing I disliked most about Birthright was wha...The thing I disliked most about <I>Birthright</I> was what it did to Pa Kent. Pre-BR and Post-BR Jonathan Kent are completely different characters in both personality and appearance. Continuity quibbles aside, though, I hated how he and Clark now had a strained relationship.<BR/><BR/>The greatest thing about John Byrne's run in my opinion (and proof that even a broken clock is right twice a day) is that Clark had a loving and open relationship with both his parents, making him an even greater foil for both Batman and Wonder Woman. So now that Pa is a gaunt, emotionally closed man (who will apparently die in the upcoming Brainiac story arc), I think part of the Superman mythos has died with the friendly little old man he used to be.<BR/><BR/>I don't know who first said it, but I like the idea that while Superman got his powers from Jor-El, he learned how to be a hero from Jonathan Kent. With <I>Birthright</I>'s retcon, that's no longer true.Will Stapleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05102456593495895955noreply@blogger.com